Welcome, OpenSUSE developers!
Friday, November 24th, 2006Novell’s decision to go to great lengths to circumvent the patent framework clearly articulated in the GPL has sent shockwaves through the community. If you are an OpenSUSE developer who is concerned about the long term consequences of this pact, you may be interested in some of the events happening next week as part of the Ubuntu Open Week:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek
We are hosting a series of introductory sessions for people who want to join the Ubuntu community – in any capacity, including developers and package maintainers. If you want to find out how Ubuntu works, how to contribute or participate, or how to get specific items addressed, there will be something for you. I’ll also be on IRC on Tuesday 28th to answer any questions you may have of me specifically, such as Luis’ questions about our position on software patents.
There are a couple of sessions that would be particularly interesting for folks familiar with OpenSUSE. The Kubuntu team is hosting some events during the week to look at KDE and Ubuntu and to discuss the roadmap of their project. There are also a few events being hosted by the Ubuntu Desktop team’s, which I think should include some discussion of the ideas that came from the recent Ubuntu Developer Summit in Mountain View. There are a couple of Packaging 101 and Package Maintenance sessions too, specifically for developers.
Ubuntu is structured to empower our community to get things done, and to maximise the opportunity for collaboration between teams that share a common vision (even if it’s not 100% of their vision, such as between the Gnome, KDE and XFCE desktop teams). While we’re always open to new members, we thought it would be a good idea to identify a dedicated week where new members would be the focus for our whole project.
If you have an interest in being part of a vibrant community that cares about keeping free software widely available and protecting the rights of people to get it free of charge, free to modify, free of murky encumbrances and “undisclosed balance sheet liabilities”, then please do join us.
November 27th, 2006 at 8:48 pm
[…] Mark Shuttleworth is trying to entice OpenSUSE developers to join Ubuntu. “Novell’s decision to go to great lengths to circumvent the patent framework clearly articulated in the GPL has sent shockwaves through the community. If you are an OpenSUSE developer who is concerned about the long term consequences of this pact, you may be interested in some of the events happening next week as part of the Ubuntu Open Week.” […]
November 28th, 2006 at 4:32 am
I agree with Marks invitation, but I can’t accept the inclusion of binary driver by default. So Mark’s invitation only makes sense if he refrains from including the binary drivers by default.
Also the inclusion of binary drivers by default would be a gross violation of Ubuntu principles and philosophy. Let’s see why:
Ubuntu distro says:
Quote:
«Ubuntu is entirely committed to the principles of open source software development; no part of it will ever be proprietary, and we encourage people to use it, improve it and pass it on.»
So, what part of «no part of it will ever be proprietary” mr Mark doesn’t understand?
The inclusion of the binary drivers would be lieying to Ubuntu users, would be a fraude!
And those are the kind of attitudes one expects from Microsoft, not from Mark or Ubuntu.
regards, zetettic
November 28th, 2006 at 7:03 am
I see no problem with Mark Shuttleworth inviting developers of OpenSuse.
Nobody was coerced nor threatened.
He is presenting them an opportunity that was taken away by the Novell-Microsoft deal to FOSS OpenSuse developers – that is, the right to create income stream from the contributions they made.
It’s not Suse vs. Ubuntu. It’s about community and ecology. This is about everybody having a home in FOSS.
😉
November 28th, 2006 at 9:11 am
Well…this is a good feat from Mark to lure the confused developers of open suse. But I would rather call this a smart and intelligent move. We all know about the evil assosiated with Microsoft for ages, very soon its going to come up with IP related case on Linux users as its shipping lots of utilities on Mono which is heavly patented indirectly from Novell.
Foss comunity should look into new emerging era Free Sun Java and should adapt it to the defacto…..
November 28th, 2006 at 12:59 pm
Bienvenidos, desarrolladores OpenSUSE…
Aprovechando la mala fama que le provocó a SUSE el acuerdo entre Novell y Microsoft en la comunidad Open Source, Mark Shuttleworth mandó un mail a la lista de correo de OpenSUSE, invitando a los programadores a unirse al equipo de Ubuntu.
“La decis…
November 28th, 2006 at 3:40 pm
I’m really, really sorry to say this Mark, but as I temptee to Ubuntu I’ve now been put off by your statement.
Ubuntu is in no way free anymore – your inclusion of non-OSS packages in the general distribution is actually exactly the opposite from openSUSE, who offer it as an extra. What you’ve talked about regarding ‘switching’ is complete blarney and ‘sales pitch’-speak. You don’t care about openSUSE developers. You only care about yourself and the glee factor you’d get from stealing coders from other projects.
Also, despite it having the backing and funding from Novell, I have decided I’m sticking to openSUSE, but at least they are being true to themselves.
November 28th, 2006 at 10:49 pm
Funny you’re saying “I think the position taken by Novell leadership in their contract with Microsoft is hugely disrespectful of the contributions of thousands of GPL programmers and contributors”. I too find disrespectfull to X.org/kernel hacker’s work to provide non-free binary drivers enabled by default for the sake of bling.
November 28th, 2006 at 11:19 pm
I’m a BIG fan of Free Software (so far, ALL the software I’ve developed has been publised under GPL or LGPL licenses)!
That said, I have to admit that, in the REAL WORLD (I mean both homes and enterprises), there is, indeed, the need to use some closed source applications, drivers an so on!
The end user, usally, doesn’t care about the license, just want the damn system to work smoothly and, if it’s free (as in beer), much better, otherwise they will just try to get a copy from a friend and use it (yes, even in big corporations!).
It’s a pitty that there are so many ones who try to change the world by obliging the others to behave in the “right” way (i.e., the way they feel it’s right). Hitler, Stalin and Mao, among other, tried that and failed (fortunally, I think).
Why not simply distribute the proprietary code in a ‘tainted’ repository (so that all can figure which software is free and which is not) and then let the users decide which to use? If you continue to force the “Joe user” to search in the net for unofficial repositories, you’re doing exactly what Microsoft (and others) will like you to do: make it difficult (or even impossible) for the average user to use Linux.
I do think that the way to go is to include all the software (mainly the drivers!) that one can legaly include in a distro and let the user decide which to use! It’s much more simple to the geeks to comment a line in ‘sources.list’, that it is for my mother to add one just to get the damn wireless card to work.
Think about it 😉
November 29th, 2006 at 12:22 am
[…] Link: Welcome, OpenSUSE developers! (Vía OSNews) […]
November 29th, 2006 at 1:46 pm
[…] Heute gibt es zum Beispiel um 18 Uhr UTC (also 19 Uhr in Deutschland) eine offene Diskussion über die umstrittene Einladung von Mark Shuttleworth an die OpenSUSE-Entwickler. In der Einladung lud er jeden OpenSUSE-Entwickler, der Bedenken bezüglich des Deals von Novell mit Microsoft hat, ein, sich für Ubuntu zu engagieren. Dies löste eine kontroverse Diskussion aus, die heute höchstwahrscheinlich ihren Höhepunkt (und hoffentlich auch ihren Schlusspunkt) finden wird. Um neuen Community-Mitgliedern den Einstieg zu erleichtern, wird es am 1. Dezember eine offene Fragerunde, den »Freshers Day« geben, in der erfahrene Ubuntunutzer und -entwickler ihr Wissen den Neuzugängen weitergeben. Der Freshers Day sowie alle anderen Vorträge werden im Internet Relay Chat (IRC) abgehalten. Weitere Infos und die komplette Übersicht der Vorträge sind im Ubuntu-Wiki zu finden. Wer einen Vortrag verpasst, kann sich auch nachträglich die Logs der Vorträge durchlesen. Dennis Dirdjaja Gespeichert in: Ubuntu […]
November 30th, 2006 at 8:19 pm
sorry but, ubuntu sucks… SuSE roks !!
November 30th, 2006 at 10:23 pm
all those who are surprised by this haven’t been paying attention lately. All those accusing people who oppose binary only kernel modules of hypocrisy because of ‘non-free’ hardware and firmware are setting up a straw man. We pay for the hardware (and anything that gets loaded on it), there is no requirement for that to be open source. Just the software that runs as part of the operating system needs to be open source.
mark et al would tell you that they apply ‘market pressure’ to vendors with closed binary only drivers but this is a fable. By incorporating more and more non-free blobs into the kernel and elsewhere they are enabling those vendors to ignore the calls to open source their hardware specifications since their hardware now ‘runs on linux’.
Feel free to try and call me a hypocrite on this issue, I run OpenBSD.
December 1st, 2006 at 2:28 pm
So many sad arguments…
I have been using Ubuntu linux for 14 months now, been a Windows users since version 3.0 came out, DOS since 1985 and I had been a CP/M user before that. Until Ubuntu Linux came along I could not get rid of Windows entirely. Ubuntu Linux has been the first Linux distro (and I have been using Linux since 1995) that have allowed me to actually use Linux as opposed to tinkering with config files all day.
The point is that USER CONVENIENCE is paramount. This is 2006, there is no such thing as the “Lone Ranger” anymore. Open Source is great, but it has to live hand-in-hand with registered intellectual property. That is why binary (closed) drivers MUST be included for convenience.
As an end-user, I do not appreciate the hassle and incovenience that the “Open Source Zealots” impose on me. It is a nightmare – most of my current Linux problems comes from trying to integrate “Business Standard Solutions” into my PC. I am talking about Flash, RealPlayer, Quicktime, Skype, USB-2, KQEMU, Logitech hardware and various off-the-shelf printers. All those packages/products/drivers are freely available, but because of the moralistic stance taken by the “Zealots” end users are faced with severe technical hurdles to integrate those products in Linux when the solution could have been so easy. This is not acceptable to me.
For Linux, the road to success lies in conquering the end-user desktops one by one. And creating something that is very difficult to integrate into the “real world” end-user computing experience is not the way to conquer new desktops. IMHO the stance of the “Open Source Zealots” is causing more direct harm to the wide-based acceptance of Linux than the current Microsoft – Novell agreement.
Not that I trust Microsoft, but Novell will ultimately pay the price for their errors, not Linux!
December 5th, 2006 at 3:38 am
I have been using Linux since December 1998, and have been online since January 1996. (I came to the world of Linux from the world of OS/2.) What you are doing for the world is a great thing.
The Cybernightlife project started as an OS/2 support site back in July 1996, and has evolved into a Linux support site with emphasis on the home and small business markets.
Your distribution, along with its derivatives such as MEPIS, are best suited for home and small business use.
While the Novell deal with Microsoft may have benefits, history has shown that Microsoft simply cannot be trusted, with much of the supporting evidence presented in the antitrust case of 1998.
While Microsoft may have some good products, it is their business practices that are very questionable at best, especially from the point of view of customer service and satisfaction.
Having tried various distributions, I can see why your distribution is ranked the best.
Keep up the good work.
December 5th, 2006 at 11:52 pm
[…] That post is now the first google hit for ‘ubuntu patents’ and many variations thereof. I’m glad Mark apparently thought the issue was important enough to address in IRC, and I’m sorry that I’ve been too busy with exams to actually attend the IRC session. Hopefully Canonical will post something that clarifies the situation so that my post drops off Google’s radar in favor of something that is more official, less speculative, and less ambiguous. […]
December 11th, 2006 at 11:03 am
[…] and the matching blogpost […]
December 11th, 2006 at 11:03 am
[…] and the matching blogpost […]
December 13th, 2006 at 5:40 am
What baby’s developers are, crying about Mark sending mail to the suse list. Sad thing is a lot of nerdy developers are exactly that, a bunch of troglodytes with no real world experience to flavor their development. All these comments here show that the linux community are a big bunch of babies! Yeah, I said it, and I have been using linux since uhm … 1997? There are a lot of things to stand for in life.. you might want to give your own self a chance to earn some wisdom and stop crying. Stop being a bunch of malignant sheep that jump on the bandwagon.. think for yourself .. you one track minded idiot.
December 13th, 2006 at 6:24 pm
i think all the developers should accept the invitation and move away from suse,
i hope novell dies quickly ,
ubuntu rulz
December 19th, 2006 at 1:38 pm
[…] Mark Shuttleworth has recently posted on his blog an invitation to OpenSuse developers to join the Ubuntu community, concluding that if you have an interest in being part of a vibrant community that cares about keeping free software widely available and protecting the rights of people to get it free of charge, free to modify, free of murky encumbrances and “undisclosed balance sheet liabilities”, then please do join us. […]
March 8th, 2007 at 12:36 pm
[…] Playfully attacking Novell on making deals is easy, but at least Novell has chances of getting on the Linux PC market, something I have not seen yet from Canonical. […]
April 4th, 2007 at 7:44 am
Ubuntu needs to be packed with more *useful* packages 🙂
May 16th, 2007 at 1:08 pm
Just wanted to thank Novell for cutting a deal with M$, thus reinforcing their claims that Linux has infringed over 300 patents by paying royalties. Nice once Novell…….
June 13th, 2007 at 3:40 pm
Some people complain because Ubuntu uses non-free drivers.
I propose to these people to be more constructive: join and help the “High Priority Free Software Projects”, see
http://www.fsf.org/campaigns/priority.html
instead of complaining to Ubuntu.
July 9th, 2007 at 2:24 pm
[…] Mark Shuttleworth’s latest reaction is neither hostile nor approving although he did earlier incite OpenSUSE developers to defect to Ubuntu and can now be quoted as saying: “We have declined to discuss any agreement with Microsoft […]
July 17th, 2007 at 3:42 am
[…] After the deal, many hard critics came from the community. Some stated that Novell had sell out. Others, wanted to hold the community together by embracing the displeased developers. This was the case of Mark Shuttleworth. He sent an open invitation to OpenSUSE developers, to join the Ubuntu team. Part of the community, like me, saw this as a support to OpenSUSE developers and an opportunity for Ubuntu to add very valuable developers. Critics to this action came mostly from members of the Novell community. Their statement was that this invitation would only make OpenSUSE situation worst. I think that is an excellent point, but misses to see the importance of the invitation. It was intended to keep OpenSUSE developers, willing to leave Novell’s surroundings, inside the community. Mark Shuttleworth’s invitation. […]
July 28th, 2007 at 9:28 am
[…] letter, or as he calls it an invitation, has been published @Mark Shuttleworth blog and announced on the opensuse mailing lists…. the idea behind as I see is plain and simple: […]
August 28th, 2007 at 1:26 am
Jumped into Ubuntu several months ago. I’m one of the poor people that wouldn’t ever be able to afford something this good. Much less have it delivered to his house in another country at that. So I just wanted to thank all those that have made my Ubuntu experience a pleasurable one. With that said I wanted to thank personally everyone from Mark to all the way on down to shipit.’s team in the mail room. Thanks !
September 22nd, 2007 at 8:40 am
We would like to get hold of Mark Shuttleworth with regards to the tranport project that was published in the newspaper yesterday – we have been involved in this for the past 5 years and have great vision for the business but have not been able to get the finance – please can we send our business plan for perusal.
Thanks very much,
Boris Miller and Rob Louw
October 28th, 2007 at 7:48 pm
[…] read more | digg story […]
April 14th, 2008 at 8:29 pm
[…] Welcome, OpenSUSE developers!, here be dragons, Mark Shuttleworth (Blog) […]
April 30th, 2008 at 11:51 am
[…] Shuttleworth has recently posted on his blog an invitation to OpenSuse developers to join the Ubuntu community, concluding that if you have an interest in […]
July 1st, 2009 at 6:06 am
[…] did you use. but you can not change philosophy of distro. and when mark superhero write some post Mark Shuttleworth
July 15th, 2010 at 4:27 am
[…] to technology. In this part of the world I know of very few people (eg, Phil Duff of SYSPRO and Mark Shuttleworth of Ubuntu fame) who appreciate how to create and use technology in a way that is applicable to the developing […]
August 2nd, 2011 at 12:33 am
[…] movimiento del contrario y obtener lo que se desea, y así son todas las acciones de Mark. Una mala invitación fué hecha por parte de Shuttleworth. Hoy leyendo en http://planet.debian.net me topé con la entrada de Josselin Mouette titulada […]
August 15th, 2011 at 5:18 pm
[…] movimiento del contrario y obtener lo que se desea, y así son todas las acciones de Mark. Una mala invitación fué hecha por parte de Shuttleworth. Hoy leyendo en http://planet.debian.net me topé con la entrada de Josselin Mouette titulada […]